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	<title>Comments on: messy but necessary</title>
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	<link>http://flipfloppingjoy.com/2009/06/27/messy-but-necessary/</link>
	<description>it's where the movement is...</description>
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		<title>By: Blog Review: Flip Flopping Joy &#171; Pathological Narcissist</title>
		<link>http://flipfloppingjoy.com/2009/06/27/messy-but-necessary/comment-page-1/#comment-6346</link>
		<dc:creator>Blog Review: Flip Flopping Joy &#171; Pathological Narcissist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Aug 2009 17:15:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flipfloppingjoy.com/?p=1352#comment-6346</guid>
		<description>[...] few of my favorite FFJ posts: Messy but Necessary I Am Learning To Respect &#8220;Radical Love&#8221;: What Is That?     Posted by [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] few of my favorite FFJ posts: Messy but Necessary I Am Learning To Respect &#8220;Radical Love&#8221;: What Is That?     Posted by [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Nora</title>
		<link>http://flipfloppingjoy.com/2009/06/27/messy-but-necessary/comment-page-1/#comment-5384</link>
		<dc:creator>Nora</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:47:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flipfloppingjoy.com/?p=1352#comment-5384</guid>
		<description>This is a post I will be returning to; all of your observations are so well taken, thank you.
I also really liked the quote @susurro highlighted, and this one:

&quot;often i have had to make these choices on the spot. with little to no background information.  feeling a little lost in the swirling demands emotions running high.  and i can say that even hind sight is rarely 20/20.&quot;  I really relate to this as someone who is mostly relatively privileged, with little activist experience, who has relatively recently moved to a city with a very intense history, and is trying to figure out how to support social justice projects without really knowing all of what&#039;s in play (oh, and while trying to start a healthcare clinic...hmmm...).  

Emotions can run really high, because the stakes are high, and there is a long history of hurt and abuse and neglect and disappointment; but the flipside of emotions NOT running high seems to be endemic depression, which is also very sticky.  

But &quot;sitting back&quot; as you point out is not really an acceptable alternative to taking the risk of fucking up.  And I wonder about the people who sit out, drop out, never try, or show up but don&#039;t speak, how their silence is or is not factored into the &quot;four or five different opinions&quot; (the way not voting is a vote)?

Thanks again for this...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a post I will be returning to; all of your observations are so well taken, thank you.<br />
I also really liked the quote @susurro highlighted, and this one:</p>
<p>&#8220;often i have had to make these choices on the spot. with little to no background information.  feeling a little lost in the swirling demands emotions running high.  and i can say that even hind sight is rarely 20/20.&#8221;  I really relate to this as someone who is mostly relatively privileged, with little activist experience, who has relatively recently moved to a city with a very intense history, and is trying to figure out how to support social justice projects without really knowing all of what&#8217;s in play (oh, and while trying to start a healthcare clinic&#8230;hmmm&#8230;).  </p>
<p>Emotions can run really high, because the stakes are high, and there is a long history of hurt and abuse and neglect and disappointment; but the flipside of emotions NOT running high seems to be endemic depression, which is also very sticky.  </p>
<p>But &#8220;sitting back&#8221; as you point out is not really an acceptable alternative to taking the risk of fucking up.  And I wonder about the people who sit out, drop out, never try, or show up but don&#8217;t speak, how their silence is or is not factored into the &#8220;four or five different opinions&#8221; (the way not voting is a vote)?</p>
<p>Thanks again for this&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: guerilla mama</title>
		<link>http://flipfloppingjoy.com/2009/06/27/messy-but-necessary/comment-page-1/#comment-5383</link>
		<dc:creator>guerilla mama</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 09:54:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flipfloppingjoy.com/?p=1352#comment-5383</guid>
		<description>@whatsername
yes ive been thinking a lot about what are our expectations of our community and our leaders...
@susurro
please feel free to use this however you see fit.  its something that i have to remind myself of all the time...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@whatsername<br />
yes ive been thinking a lot about what are our expectations of our community and our leaders&#8230;<br />
@susurro<br />
please feel free to use this however you see fit.  its something that i have to remind myself of all the time&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: where ive been &#171; guerrilla mama medicine</title>
		<link>http://flipfloppingjoy.com/2009/06/27/messy-but-necessary/comment-page-1/#comment-5381</link>
		<dc:creator>where ive been &#171; guerrilla mama medicine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 08:11:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flipfloppingjoy.com/?p=1352#comment-5381</guid>
		<description>[...] messy but necessary [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] messy but necessary [...]</p>
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		<title>By: susurro</title>
		<link>http://flipfloppingjoy.com/2009/06/27/messy-but-necessary/comment-page-1/#comment-5370</link>
		<dc:creator>susurro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 04:44:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flipfloppingjoy.com/?p=1352#comment-5370</guid>
		<description>actually i find that if i cant name at least 4 or 5 &quot;differing opinions with in the community i am working with in solidarity, then i have not built the necessary quantity or quality of relationships.&quot;

If it is ok, I plan to take this to a community meeting I have next week that has been struggling both with their own identity as organizers and with conflict from other organizers from similar or intersecting community ids. It seems like something we all need to remember when building solidarity movements and thinking about what we mean when we say &quot;community&quot; about anything.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>actually i find that if i cant name at least 4 or 5 &#8220;differing opinions with in the community i am working with in solidarity, then i have not built the necessary quantity or quality of relationships.&#8221;</p>
<p>If it is ok, I plan to take this to a community meeting I have next week that has been struggling both with their own identity as organizers and with conflict from other organizers from similar or intersecting community ids. It seems like something we all need to remember when building solidarity movements and thinking about what we mean when we say &#8220;community&#8221; about anything.</p>
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		<title>By: whatsername</title>
		<link>http://flipfloppingjoy.com/2009/06/27/messy-but-necessary/comment-page-1/#comment-5363</link>
		<dc:creator>whatsername</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 28 Jun 2009 00:03:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://flipfloppingjoy.com/?p=1352#comment-5363</guid>
		<description>Especially in light of the last week, this seems very well timed and appropriate.  Thank you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Especially in light of the last week, this seems very well timed and appropriate.  Thank you.</p>
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