Comments on: what is butch?

By: FWD/Forward » Gender presentation, disability and intersections

FWD/Forward » Gender presentation, disability and intersections — Sun, 18 Oct 2009 00:02:19 +0000

[...] conversation in the blogosphere about gender presentation and disability. Jumping off from bfp’s what is butch? (check out the comments for some interesting disability discussion) a range of commenters and [...]

By: calyx

calyx — Mon, 01 Jun 2009 06:52:29 +0000

Yeah, I know maintaining my appearance is a real hassle most days, and sometimes I love to dress up when I don’t have the energy to leave the house, just wear glam stuff around the place. I feel pretty fragile on those days though so I tend to want to be a bit invisible outside, not too dressy, just in case I’m hunched or forgotten to do something basic with appearance like cleaning the sleep out of my eyes or the dirt off my glasses or stuff out of my hair (I kid you not). And non-dressy-femme stuff means it’s easier for me to carry things off my back/shoulders (which are f**ked). But I can do low-maintenance femme just as well as one can do low-maintenance butch.

By: material world

material world — Fri, 29 May 2009 17:13:53 +0000

really interesting thread.

I wonder if butches being more glossy is because it’s easier to see each other now, with internet and digital cameras, so people want to get creative? Flaunt it a bit?

I did it the other way round with disability; got more dressy femme as my disabilities got worse. Because for me butch femme isn’t all like, who wears the pants or dresses, so much as feeling I can express all this stuff about gender, class, ‘deviant’ womanhood and desire. Like how it feels to be comfortable with all my stuff in my body and recognize it in other queers. I really value that boost more on bad days now, so I get femme when I can. Not that, that means like, high heels when I can’t walk well, cos I don’t do heels anyway.

By: calyx

calyx — Fri, 29 May 2009 10:35:15 +0000

To me, butch and femme have little to do with being high maintenance or not. More that butch and femme are informed by traditional male and female appearances – and it is that men’s clothes are usually more low-key and comfy, same goes for other aspects of appearance. Women’s clothes and appearance tend to be high maintenance. I’d put a lot of this difference down to sexism. I think there are aspects of butch that are being about being the looker, and aspects of femme that are being about being looked at, but that’s not universal. And there are plenty of ways to be butch and high maintenance, and femme and low maintenance.

Speaking personally, I ID as (cis) femme most of the time, and I don’t do any high maintenance stuff. Don’t pluck, don’t shave, don’t paint, don’t buff, don’t moisturise, don’t style, don’t diet, don’t do any of that stuff (except over-the-top makeup occasionally). My shoes are my roots into the ground – sensible. I mistook all that for butch in myself for a long while, but there is something about my sexuality, my desire in self-presentation, the way I move, that made me realise that femme described me better. There is heaps about me that people might call butch, just cos I have a lot more in common with most contemporary males than females, and I lead a practical everyday life in what I wear, but nope, goddess, glamour-puss, princess, medusa, faery, witch, drag queen, amazon, all these describe my essence. For me, doing high femme once in a blue moon feels like “drag” (for want of a better word), but it sure is fun!

I think it is sexism and cis-centric to say that femme must mean the same thing as conventional femininity, or even women, and same goes for butch regarding men. I mean, there are femme trans men out there for example.

By: 3 posts/comment threads on butch/femme & disability - read ‘em. — Hoyden About Town

Fri, 29 May 2009 09:08:44 +0000

[...] bfp at Flip Flopping Joy: “what is butch?” but then i see sites specifically for butches–and all i see are women who clearly are [...]

By: Meep

Meep — Thu, 28 May 2009 06:41:28 +0000

Adding my two cents for what it’s worth.

Being formerly FTM identified… I just don’t know what to do with the whole butch/femme thing! I love dressing masculinly but I am not very masculine in thought. Eh. I thought I had more to say but maybe not online…

By: cripchick

cripchick — Wed, 27 May 2009 00:28:40 +0000

thankful for this post.

By: Thanks for the millionth time to BFP… « Bloggity Blog Blog Blog…

Tue, 26 May 2009 05:56:22 +0000

[...] @ 5:56 am Although the link at the beginning is problematic in several ways, reading bfp’s what is butch? post and comment thread – and the very fact of it being discussed in the context of [...]

By: wheelchairdancer

wheelchairdancer — Tue, 26 May 2009 02:41:14 +0000

ooohh! Squeeeee. And LOL. I’ve just read the comments thread … You see me as femme. Delighted to be seen on the other side of the divide. (yes, I know, that’s the same reaction cripchick had). I wonder if that’s because people mostly only see w/c users as butch because of their disability prejudice?

Anyway. I just wrote this whole post on the “butch” as the way others see me — in an attempt to join the conversation.

We intersect again!

Smilingly,

WCD

By: on gender and disability | cripchick's weblog

on gender and disability | cripchick's weblog — Mon, 25 May 2009 16:34:44 +0000

[...] as i’m not a gender scholar (damn you academic industrial complex!) BFP’s recent post, what is butch?, is pushing me forward and i’m hoping that this can be a place where we can talk about gender [...]