I have to say like Aaminah I was confused and surprised by the WOC blow-up over this post. I appreciate that people have broken down what hurt them b/c I understand much better what’s going on now.

Apart from blogging for a small Canadian feminist blog and now Racialicious, I haven’t been a participant really in the blog wars. But I just wanted to say that when BFP’s blog went down last year, I was totally and utterly devastated. As someone who was struggling so much in the white feminist blogosphere world, it was truly heartbreaking to see how much that world had hurt someone as fierce as BFP and who I admired so much. It’s horrifying to me that that could happen again via something like this blow-up, and I’m very heartened to see how people are taking initiative to try and sort this out.

The idea that Latoya may be selling out to the white/mainstream blogosphere or letting herself get “tokenised” doesn’t read for me because Latoya isn’t using guest stints on Feministe or the broad coverage Racialicious gets to make mad cash, or even establish herself as pre-eminent WOC blogger. (as we all know we do this stuff because as the WOC we are we need to fight this fight, not because it’s paying out bills)

Latoya does what she does in the way that she does because she has found it is the best way to get her message out to as many people as possible.

I identify as a radical WOC and am more of a justice person than a reform person, but at the same time as a writer/blogger/critic I just want my message to go as far as possible. (does that make me not a radical? i guess we can talk about this on lisa’s blog)

I didn’t grow up in a home that was all WOC, rah rah rah! My mumma (who is white) still can’t accept that I’m a WOC. And so many of the radical folks I met early in my journey did not want to engage with me, did not want to talk to me, b/c they just saw me as a sell-out or token.

I’m never gonna reach the girls who were as lost as I was if I only engage with other POCs. NOT of course that I am saying it is wrong to only want to be with POCs/WOCs. I do very much understand that impulse. But I think that, similar to Latoya, my life experiences inform who I want to reach out to, and who I want to reach out to does not know about the RWOC blogosphere.

I do think it’s hurtful to ever say that another WOC is a “token.” People make their choices based on whatever byzantine complex life experiences they have had. So to judge that without knowing their whole back story is cruel, and harmful to the movement in general to create a world where WOC can just be who they damn well are.

We gotta employ so many different strategies to make that world. I’m in solidarity with anyone whose trying to make that world, however they’re trying to do that, however they identify.

See y’all over at Lisa’s!

That’s all I’m saying.

The question is easily on the other foot here, BFP. Why didn’t you email me? My personal email address has been unchanged for almost five years now, and you can always email me through my site. You’ve changed your email address since the last time we’ve spoken.

In addition, Courtney reached out to me. She came to me with a project she asked if I wanted to contribute to. Yesterday, I got a call from a radio station, who also asked me if I wanted to work with them on a segment. I’m just busy. That isn’t to say that you aren’t – we all are – but I’ve definately been too focused on my current workload to do anything but receive and respond. I’m not currently pitching/reaching at the moment.

Anyway, I started engaging over at Lisa’s, see you there.

yeah, I’m all for that, I just got the message that Sudy had posted something so we can definitly head over there–the one thing I did want to say before we head over there–this part–

I don’t think that we’re talking to each other as much as we’re talking to white women

Really, BFP? I’m a little confused at that one again. My core audience over at my spot isn’t white. The people I deal with for business reasons are about half white and half WoC. The speaking stuff is to a primarily white audience, but that’s because I’m either trying to integrate something or because of barriers to entry like cost, something I hope will become less of an issue as time goes on and we find different ways to transmit information.

I think we do. I mean, you mentioned Courtney–that’s one more conversation with her than you’ve had with me, you know? And I’m totally not saying that to be a total bitch and all, why didn’t you email me???? I’m just saying that to point out that there is LOTS of potential for us to get on the same page, cuz we haven’t even started trying yet! And I would hope that there’s a way (I can’t see why there wouldn’t be) where rather than acting as a monitoring force with each other, we can work in that way that you said at the very beginning–working at sort of multiple points to get the same thing done. If we can figure out some way, (like through a blog or a conversation at Sudy’s or SOMETHING) where your more immediate efforts can become coordinated with our more long term efforts–where could we go? I’m so with you on that, but first I need to get off my ass and email you (or join the conversation w/Sudy, or whatever)–just long story short, ALL of us need to figure out a way to reach out.

And then rub each other’s damn shoulders, because we (well, maybe it’s just freaking ME!!!:->) are too fucking stressed by this shit!!!!

See you over at Sudy’s….

Well, I must admit, I was a bit taken aback by the post. It feels like the theme for this week is “talk about some shit Latoya said.” This is blog #3…

But anyway, no it’s fine. I don’t mind providing answers. I tend to run into problems when people don’t accept my answers about how my life is working.

i think that I have some differences from where you are coming from Latoya, from the small ones (for example, I dislike “useful” because I’ve been “used” enough, I don’t need my contemporaries using me too, ya know?), to bigger ones (I would never ever go on Reilly, ever for any reason)

And that’s kind of the rub, isn’t it. You dislike “useful,” I dislike the implications of “essential.” You’d never go on Bill O., I would hold my breath and rep for the hip-hop generation.

This isn’t surprising. We are different people with different life experiences with different outlooks on the same situations.

Which makes this bit:

I just wonder how we can all get on the same page with things?

A wee bit difficult. I’m not even sure we are reading the same book. It’s not like I’m not paying attention – I enjoy reading you and Sudy’s ruminations on life, the universe, and everything – but I’m not sure what you want to do. From where I sit, it appears that y’all are both healing and preparing for the next phase, which is totally necessary. But that’s different than Carmen calling me and saying “What are we going to do about international coverage on Racialicious?” or “What’s our plan for SXSW” or “Where’s the series on Cultural Appropriation.” Or even larger things – we need to think about a racism 101 site thing. But there’s always something concrete and that’s how I work the best. You talked about some misunderstanding with you and Adele because of your styles – it’s the same thing here. If Adele sends me an article she wrote, I can go “Oh, I can promote this on my website.” There’s a job for me to do.

I am process oriented. So I don’t think about the work in themes of submission/nonsubmission, I think about it in terms of opportunity/lack of opportunity.

I mean, do we really have to sacrafice each other so that our message gets out into a larger world?

I would hope not. But in cases like that, I felt the greater good was the way I chose. You’re welcome to disagree. Can we plan something going forward? Sure. But I feel like there are some fundamental differences in how we view the same things which will make things challenging. I’m not always interested in the grand gestures, I’m interested in the most effective way to create change. So maybe it is a boycott. Or maybe it’s simply promoting a new source of info. Or maybe it’s assembling a larger revenue stream and buying someone out. Every situation is different.

I don’t think that we’re talking to each other as much as we’re talking to white women

Really, BFP? I’m a little confused at that one again. My core audience over at my spot isn’t white. The people I deal with for business reasons are about half white and half WoC. The speaking stuff is to a primarily white audience, but that’s because I’m either trying to integrate something or because of barriers to entry like cost, something I hope will become less of an issue as time goes on and we find different ways to transmit information.

I agree with renee that would should start looking for ways to support each other, even if we’re going in different directions.

I agree as well. I always appreciate support and backup. But I also think we define support a little differently. Does this mean every action I take needs to be vetted before I do it? Or does that mean we supply help when needed/requested? Do we start a support group? I don’t know either. But I think that it is more a question of figuring out what the goal is.

Maybe we should move this convo to Sudy’s blog…

First, thank you so much for your in depth reply–even if say, you were like, FUCK YOU BFP, I”ll NEVER READ YOUR DAMN BLOG AGAIN MUCH LESS “WORK” WITH YOU!–the fact that you took the time to explain where you were coming from really means a lot.

I think in large part, my nerves are SO freaking raw from the CONSTANT negativity surrounding anything radical woc do–I mean, we haven’t really “done” anything except be introspective and kumbaya-y for the last 6 months, and even that pisses people off. So when we get stuck in the middle of this mess *again*–and new people don’t really know what the history is and speak *just enough* truth that people take them seriously–but it’s not the *whole* truth…and then you combine that with the regular constant influx of hateration that we get just because…

I admit, my nerves just get frayed and suddenly Latoya or Renee speaking a truth, but a *different* truth, I get all–well, if you don’t appreciate me than I will just gather up my expensive toys and GO HOME, WAH WAH! haha.

Seriously tho. i think that I have some differences from where you are coming from Latoya, from the small ones (for example, I dislike “useful” because I’ve been “used” enough, I don’t need my contemporaries using me too, ya know?), to bigger ones (I would never ever go on Reilly, ever for any reason), but over ALL, what I’m reading from your words is that each moment as a woman of color is riddle with moments where we have to make choices–and those choices are never easy and are always second guessed, almost always by others, and every once in a while, by ourselves, something I agree with totally and whole heartedly. For what it’s worth, I don’t think for a minute you made the wrong choices–I just wonder how we can all get on the same page with things? Like, for example, if I don’t choose to submit and another woman *does* choose to submit–but we *both* know that we are “tokens”–how can we work together to confront that, while also making sure that our individual choices are respected? I mean, do we really have to sacrafice each other so that our message gets out into a larger world? Or so that we can make a point about tokenism? Are those the only choices we have hear?

I don’t think that we’re talking to each other as much as we’re talking to white women–I agree with renee that would should start looking for ways to support each other, even if we’re going in different directions. I’m not sure how to do that–and I’m not sure if we all want to or feel we need to start talking with each other….but I guess that’s the point i’m coming to after this whole damn mess….

Sorry about getting to this so late, there’s been a bunch on my plate lately. (I’m actually stepping back from all blogs not my own until April, when all my papers and stuff are done.)

Re: Media Justice/Media Reform people –

That’s not what I was thinking at all. How do I explain this better (and with 15 mins before I have to leave for work? *sigh*)

In terms of the role of you and BA and all the other RWOC play, I think it’s very necessary and needed. I just feel like we are employing different methods to reach the same end. So, here’s the view from where I sit. I met you and crew last year at WAM and saw a tight knit group of activists and women who respected each other and loved each other. I saw you put together one of the highest attended panels at the conference. I saw that you all were creating something great, that flourished even in an environment hostile to you. In my summation, y’all are doing good. You have a crew, and a mission, and some ideas.

In my mind, that’s damn close to Nirvana because that’s all you need. (Funding is nice, but ways come with time.) So, in essence, I like and respect your crew and it appears that we are heading in similar directions. We’re just taking different paths to get there. But y’all are good. My whole thing – which is part of my personality, intrinsically – is that if someone doesn’t recognize how awesome you are, sucks for them. Keep it moving. There are people in the anti-racist sphere who have issues with me and my methods. And that’s fine – everyone doesn’t have to like what I do for me to keep doing it. I’m not going to beat my head against a wall. I’m going to work with the folks who want to work with me and work *around* those who don’t. Because there are a lot of different ways to accomplish what I need to accomplish – I don’t see the need to engage with folks who aren’t hearing me.

So my comments weren’t to say “stop fighting against the inevitable” because that’s not it. It was more of a “don’t even sweat that because there’s a better house party next door” thing.

Well, I can’t answer for BA, but for me–it matters because YOU, Latoya, a woman of color, are engaging with and finding “their” world important and essential to you and your activism.

Oh snap. *There’s* the communication breakdown. How can I on one hand say “don’t sweat these people” if I’m working with these people. Gotcha! Okay, point two – Carmen and I went through an extensive media training course last summer. So in the time since we met and now, I’ve refocused how I engage both online and offline. In a nutshell, the idea is that the message is key. You have to find a way to take your message and push it to as many people as possible. It doesn’t matter how much I personally hate Bill O’Reilly and all that he stands for – if I get a media call to do his show, I got to go. You are supposed to go where it’s hostile, go where they aren’t trying to hear you, get up there and push your message because you never know who is going to hear you. I’m not going to convince Bill O’Reilly of anything. But can I catch someone else? Can I catch someone just passively watching the program who has never thought about the issues I’m bringing to them? So that’s the basic principle of what I learned.

But back to your question – I chafe a bit at the word “essential,” but that’s just about my personality. I have 8 people who are “essential” to me in real life. And there are maybe 10 people “essential” to me in the digital world. Beyond that, well – it is what it is. People who come to me with friendship get friendship, people who come to me with bullshit get bullshit.

I understand what you mean though, I would just use the word “useful.” Which is yes, I find working with a lot of folks in the feminist establishment useful to my end goal, which is promoting the message and connecting with the people that need that message. (I also have great affection for some of these people.) And, for what it’s worth, I’ve found that most of the people I’ve worked with know me and my background well enough to not tamper with my message and to allow me to say what I want to say. So this works for me, in the context of the goals I have set. It may not work with the goals you’ve set. And there may come a time where working within those contexts and confines don’t fit my goals anymore, so I won’t do them. But the tactics I use depend on the situation and what I am trying to accomplish at that moment.

RE: Yes Means Yes

I’ll start by saying I *never* wanted to talk about this. I chose to participate and not boycott. Therefore I didn’t post up any disclaimers or what have you. I made a choice, it is what it is. But when you say:

Really honestly and TRULY–this is the way women of color who voiced dissent about the book’s title and call out are honestly perceived by other women of color?

No no no no no no no no no.

Fuck this is fucked up.

As I said in the reading I gave, I wasn’t going to submit to YMY. I didn’t feel like I had anything to say because I was not raped. And I saw the fallout with the call for submissions and most of you made excellent points on why the call was going to fall short. So I was offered a spot and I passed.

Then, around that same time, I wrote those essays on girls and statutory rape. And Carmen called me and was like “What the fuck are you doing not writing about this? This cuts so deep.” And I still didn’t want to do it. But she was right, and there was something that happened to me about 12 years ago now that I finally decided to bring to light. So I decided that would be my essay. So I wrote. I wrote for about three weeks, making myself sick, feeling drained, not wanting to remember things, until it was done. I turned it in.

*THEN* I went to WAM.

*THEN* all the Seal Press shit popped off.

*THEN* Jaclyn called me to remind me the essay was being published with them. (Commonly, calls for submissions don’t include the publisher).

Fuck. I had the option to withdraw my essay. After wrestling with the decision, I decided not to. All the reasons I forced myself to write the essay were still there. They didn’t go away. And after speaking to my media adviser, I was reminded that this book would reach people who weren’t aware of this side of the blogosphere – kind of the way Colonize This! reached me before I knew about all the resources on the internet.

So I let it be. The responses I’ve gotten let me know it was the right decision for me to make. But y’all were not wrong to protest. And you were right to call for a Girlcott.

So, in a sense, I decided to use the double edged sword. I cut myself and I cut y’all in hopes of saving some others. It was not a fun choice to make. But that’s the one I made and I stand by it.

And as much as I wish I could say that’s the end, it’s not. I accepted another call for another anthology that’s also on Seal. Picking up that same damn sword. But here’s the deal with this one: I told Courtney that I would be in her book about moments becoming a feminist, but only if I could write about not wanting to call myself a feminist anymore because of all the racist bullshit that goes down. She agreed. (This was also pre-Seal press debacle).

Now, I could get out of this fairly easily. I could explain to Courtney that I don’t want to write on a Seal Press project and that would be that. But, as I learned in media training, that is a golden opportunity. Major names are in this book. It will get major pick up, be put in libraries, all of that. And in the middle of that book about loving and embracing feminism, will be my essay about why racism turns me off feminism.

From a media standpoint, it’s gold.

From an activist standpoint, it’s tarnished brass.

But again, that’s another decision I have to make.

*I* find *you* and your presence vastly necessary in my OWN activism. If I can’t have all of you here (media justice YAY, media reform BOO) then I want to meet you half way.

Something you, Latoya, *said* you wanted. But now apparently I (media justice YAY!) am supposed to pack my bags and go find somebody else to hang with because I find working with feminist to make my skin crawl?

No, that’s not it. If people make your skin crawl, don’t work with them. If *I* make your skin crawl, don’t work with me. But I feel like media justice and media reform folks *can* work together. I just don’t feel like I have to fight with y’all. We’re working more or less toward the same ends. I have enough people to fight with who are working against what I believe – I don’t need to fight with y’all as well.

I must admit I’m kind of scratching my head here because I am wondering why the assumption is that I don’t want to work with you. I do. You inform my feminism as well. But here’s the deal – you don’t need me to work. You don’t. Y’all got it. And when I work, I focus on trying to pull the people who haven’t heard what I have to say yet. That’s it. If y’all want something from me, all you ever have to do is ask. But our goals are different. I’m not sure where my skills will help you or if you have a need for what I do. So I just assume that if you want me, you’ll say something.

In the meantime, I’ll be doing what I do. I’m trying to catch the kids who are leaving messages on my site right now about Rihanna and Chris Brown and speak to them in a way that they hear me. I’m trying to create a space for intelligent conversation about race. I’m trying to expand the field of hip-hop feminism because I feel like that speaks to women who would normally give two fucks about feminism. That’s what I’m doing. Sometimes our paths cross and it is awesome. Sometimes they don’t. But I don’t think we need to fight each other.

For more info on the work I do check out the centerformediajustice.org

But thanks for acknowledging that my feelings were hurt.